1725.3 How Do You Prove That You Are A Lawful Alien? SEE INSIDE. this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas。结论：SS可以拿！ -renrenlao(niuniu) @佛州华人论坛:佛州枫下论坛 The Rolia Forum of Florida

枫下茶话 / 美国话题 / 因为我用不了REPLY功能，所以再开新帖，继续社保的问题。如果美国社保要转到加国CPP，怎么算？要知道加国2013CPP最高只有2012/月，一般只能拿到600/月，而美国社保比这高多了。 -base2(alcohol); 2015-4-24 (#9402550@0)

美国社保怎么算？最高能拿多少？一般能拿多少？如果你用不了REPLY功能，请开新帖回答。谢谢！ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9402613@0)

算起来很复杂,最高也拿不了多少,现在平均是拿2000多一个月吧. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {905} (#9403008@0)
需要把你过去35年的最高的薪水,乘上当年的INDEXED 系数, 把过去的收入换算成今天的收入, 例如1990年你的收入是40000, 当年的系数是2.13, 那么 INDEXED 收入是4万*2.13=8.56万. 然后把所有35年INDEXED 收入相加,除以总MONTH(420), 得出AVERAGE MONTHLY 收入.

举个例子, 你今年退休, 你工作了35年, 假如你INDEXED AVERAGE YEARLY 收入是10万, 那么你的MONTHLY 收入是 10万*35/420=8333.33. SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFIT 计算方法是 first $826乘以 90%, over $826 and
less than or equal to $4,980 乘以32%, over $4,980 乘以 15%.

BENEFIT=826*0.9+(4980-826)*0.32+(8333-4980)*0.15=2576.

这就是今天退休拿的钱, 但是我们大部份移民是拿不到这个数的.

我们很少有人能工作35年,如果少于35年,依然需要用35年来平均(总MONTH 420), 上例中, 如果工作25年,那么INDEXED MONTHLY 收入是=10*25/420=5952.

BENEFIT=826*0.9+(4980-826)*0.32+(5952-4980)*0.15=2218.

如果AVERAGE INDEXED YEARLY 收入不到10万, 那就更少了.

现在有闲钱,还是多炒股,多买房吧.

Mark. -aol(华裔旅美新加侨); 2015-4-25 (#9405092@0)

按加拿大的CPP算, 你实际拿的是CPP+OAS. 不是美国公民或绿卡是拿不到SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS 的. 如果你仅是绿卡,那么你要是离开美国超过六个月也没有SSB 了. 你要退休了吗? -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 (#9402918@0)

如果同时是美国公民和加拿大公民，在美国工作25年，在加拿大工作5年，在美国退休还是加拿大退休可以拿更多社保？ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9402973@0)

美国. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 (#9403009@0)

因为美国的社保比加拿大的社保每月多几十块钱？ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403137@0)

呵呵, 数字上看,美国多于加拿大,可是实际到手的钱美国是比加拿到少的. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {299} (#9403315@0)
美国MEDICARE PAR B, 和PART D 这两部份的保费是从SSB 中扣除的, PART B 每月104, PART D 差不多30. MEDICARE 还有COINSURANCE 和DEDECTABLE, 差不多一年平均4000,每月就是350, 104+30+350=484. 这样的话, SSB<CPP+OAS 了.

其实退休后, 无论你是拿CPP+OAS, 还是SSB,又或者两者都拿, 最终你会发现,到手的钱上下差不到50.

两个都能拿，所以住哪儿都一样。主要看税务和医疗的。如果身体不好，肯定住加拿大在金钱上比较好。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403264@0)

在美国工作时间也会影响OAS的数量，比如你来北美３０年（加，美各工作，生活１５年），你的OSA只能用１５年算吧？ -freener(合适); 2015-4-24 (#9403144@0)

用30年算 -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403148@0)

OAS网站说的很清楚，按居住在加拿大的时间算。但是合格的年限把在美国的包括进去。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403247@0)

所以说，用30年算。 -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403268@0)

钱数按15年算。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 {851} (#9403280@0)
Thomas, 65, lived in Austria for much of his life. He lived in Canada for 16 years after the age of 18. This year, he moved back to Austria to be nearer his aging parents. Normally 20 years of residence in Canada is needed to receive an OAS pension outside Canada, so Thomas would normally not have qualified. However, the social security agreement with Austria allows him to count the time he lived in Austria after age 18 towards meeting the 20 -year residence-in-Canada requirement. Thomas will receive a partial OAS pension outside Canada for the rest of his life.

Note that while the social security agreement helped qualify Thomas to receive an OAS pension, the payment amount is determined by the numbers of years of residence in Canada after age 18. Having lived in Canada for 16 years, Thomas will receive 16/40ths of the full OAS pension.
http://www.servicecanada.gc.ca/eng/services/pensions/international/examples.shtml#foreign

我还有十年就退休了，到那个时候我再告诉你。 -5656(爱谁谁); 2015-4-24 (#9403217@0)

1，花谢了； 2，你忘了；3，我们也忘了。 -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 (#9403731@0)

那么加拿大社保是多少呢？美国的社保是每月2218美元。2218美元比2012加元高很多吗？ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403221@0)
不转。只是如果你都合格的话，都能拿，不会互相影响，也不会因为居住地受影响。就是可以拿SS+CPP+OAS+GIS -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403240@0)

只是申请人有美加双国籍的情况,只有一个国籍是不可能的. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 (#9403291@0)

不需要美国国籍，可能和加拿大国籍有关系。拜托读读SS的网站好不好。如果你是加拿大公民，不需要住在美加，住在中国也能拿。如果你美加公民都不是，你必须住在某些国家。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 {958} (#9403305@0)
If you are a citizen of one of the
countries listed below, we will
continue your U.S. Social Security
payments as long as you are eligible,
no matter how long you stay outside
the United States:
• Austria
• Belgium
• Canada
• Chile
• Czech Republic
• Finland
• France
• Germany
• Greece
• Ireland
• Israel
• Italy
• Japan
• Korea (South)
• Luxembourg
• Netherlands
• Norway
• Poland
• Portugal
• Spain
• Sweden
• Switzerland
• United Kingdom

Your payments will continue even if you have been outside the U.S. for more than six full calendar months, if you are a resident of a country with which the U.S. has a Social Security agreement. Currently, these countries are:
Australia France Netherlands
Austria Germany Norway
Belgium Greece Poland
Canada Ireland Portugal
Chile Italy Spain
Czech Republic Japan Sweden
Denmark Korea (South) Switzerland
Finland Luxembourg United Kingdom
http://www.ssa.gov/international/payments.html

是不是如果没有美国国籍, 就需要美国绿卡？ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403319@0) +1

不需要。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403340@0)

哪里写着不需要? -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 (#9403355@0)

哪里说需要了。SS从来和绿卡没有任何关系。和绿卡有关是误传。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403387@0)

经过大家的讨论以后，到底和绿卡有关是误传，还是和绿卡无关是误传？ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403875@0)

人家写的很明白了,根本就不给. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {1574} (#9403352@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛If you are not a U.S. citizen or a
citizen of one of the countries listed
on pages 5, 6 and 7, we will stop your
payments after you have been outside
the United States for six full calendar
months unless you meet one of the
following exceptions:
• You were eligible for monthly
Social Security benefits for
December 1956;
• You are in the active military or
naval service of the United States;
• The worker on whose record your
benefits are based had railroad work
treated as covered employment by
the Social Security program;
• The worker on whose record your
benefits are based died while in the
U.S. military service or as a result of
a service-connected disability and
was not dishonorably discharged; or
• You are a resident of a country
with which the United States has
a social security agreement.

If you are not a U.S. citizen and
none of these exceptions applies to
you, we will stop your payments
after you have been outside the
United States for six full months.
Once this happens, we cannot start
your payments again until you come
back and stay in the United States for
a whole calendar month. You must
be in the United States on the first
minute of the first day of any month
and stay through the last minute
of the last day of that month. In
addition, we may ask you to prove
you have been lawfully present in the
United States for the full calendar
month. For more information,
contact the nearest U.S. Embassy,
consulate or Social Security office.

以上所有这些都是基于一个基本条件, 就是你至少有美国绿卡.更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

糊涂了，到底是谁没读SS的网站呀？（我承认，我还没读。） -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403379@0)
如果你是加拿大公民，第一句话就把你排除了，不会stop。如果你不是，但是住在加拿大，第一段最后一个把你排除了，还是能拿。和绿卡没有关系。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403383@0)

你贴的那个第一段写的. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {629} (#9403438@0)
If you are a citizen of one of the countries listed below, we will continue your U.S. Social Security
payments as long as you are eligible, no matter how long you stay outside the United States:

不会STOP 的前提条件是"as long as you are eligible". 没绿卡ELIGIBLE?

我没自己申请过,但我帮别人ONLINE 申请过. 其中有一个要填你是否是US CITIZEN,选是,就直接进入下一步,选否,就会出来问你是啥身份,很多选项,第一个就是PERMANENT RESIDENT(选这个,要天ALIEN #,和卡#), 还有难民啥的. 我看了半天也没看到任何和签证相关的STATUS, 而不选的话,是进不了下一步的,只能去OFFICE 申请了.

当然, 我帮的申请人都是有绿卡的,所以去OFFICE 怎么申请我就不知道了.

所有的条文里都没有绿卡什么事。只是如果你在美国境内拿，就必须有合法身份。所以你在境内申请，他们要查身份。境外，就没关系了。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403482@0)

有道理，UI应当算是from SS，如果申请时回到加拿大，GC就不是必须条件了 -freener(合适); 2015-4-24 (#9403561@0)

加拿大申请UI都换成EI 了吧? UI 好像必须在本州申请? -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {309} (#9403592@0)
Most people who are eligible for unemployment benefits in Canada receive these benefits under this general eligibility provision. Benefits provided under this program are known as the regular benefits of Canada's unemployment benefit program.

还有UI和SS 可不一样,UI 虽说也是FED 发,但它可不是PUBLIC BENEFITS

可以在加拿大申请UI，他们把钱寄到或打到你的帐号里，你可在加拿大取和用, 没GC，一般不能在美国境内申请UI -freener(合适); 2015-4-24 (#9403636@0)

UI 还是和州有关. 为啥当年我老婆在VA 工作,然后搬到MD 申请UI, 人家直接说虽说你住MD, 但请回VA 申. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 (#9403647@0)

这个条文是没提绿卡,但SSA 网上写的明白, 申请SS 时要带的文件, -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {1158} (#9403584@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛• Your Social Security number;
• Your birth certificate;
• Your W-2 forms or self-employment tax return for
last year;
• Your military discharge papers if you had
military service;
• Your spouse’s birth certificate and Social Security
number if he or she is applying for benefits;
• Your children’s birth certificates and Social Security
numbers, if you’re applying for children’s benefits;
• Proof of U.S. citizenship or lawful alien status if you (or a
spouse or child applying for benefits) were not born in the
United States; and
• The name of your financial institution, the routing
number, and your account number, so your benefits can
be deposited directly into your account. If you don’t
have an account at a financial institution, or prefer
getting your benefits on a prepaid debit card, you can
get a Direct Express® card. For more information, visit
www.GoDirect.org.

这一条"Proof of U.S. citizenship or lawful alien status if you (or a spouse or child applying for benefits) were not born in the United States".

你无论在境内申请,还是在海外大使馆申请,怎么提供 lawful alien status ? TN,H1B 算吗? link:

更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
http://www.socialsecurity.gov/OP_Home/handbook/handbook.17/handbook-1725.html

你在国外申请，不会问你要。实在找不到确切答案给你，给你个congress report吧。看Special Payment Rules for Noncitizens。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 {1275} (#9403701@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛Section 202(y) of the Social Security Act requires noncitizens in the United States to be “lawfully
present” to receive benefits.16 If a noncitizen is entitled to benefits, but does not meet the lawful
presence requirement, his or her benefits are suspended.
In such cases, a noncitizen may receive benefits while residing outside the United States (including benefits based on work performed in the United States without authorization) if he or she meets one of the exceptions to the “alien nonpayment provision” under Section 202(t) of the Social Security Act.
Under the alien nonpayment provision, a noncitizen’s benefits are suspended if he or she remains outside the
United States17 for more than six consecutive months,18 unless one of several broad exceptions is met.
For example, an alien may receive benefits outside the United States if he or she is a citizen
of a country that has a social insurance or pension system that pays benefits to eligible U.S.
citizens residing outside that country (a “social insurance country”), or if he or she is a resident of
a country with which the United States has a totalization agreement (see Table 1).

大意就是你住在美国拿钱，必须是“lawful presence”。如果你不是“lawful presence”，你只能在美国境外拿钱。更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net
http://www.ilw.com/immigrationdaily/news/2011,0607-crs.pdf

lawful presence 就是 lawful alien status? 不一样吧. -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 (#9403750@0)

1725.3 How Do You Prove That You Are A Lawful Alien? SEE INSIDE. this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas。结论：SS可以拿！ -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 {1522} (#9403715@0)
本文发表在 rolia.net 枫下论坛You may be determined to be lawfully present in the U.S. as defined by the Attorney General if you are an alien who is in possession of a valid immigration documents that shows status or admission as:

Lawfully admitted for permanent residence;

Admitted as a refugee under section 207 of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA);

Granted asylum under section 208 of the INA;

Paroled under section 212(d)(5) of the INA for at least one year (except for aliens paroled for an exclusion hearing or prosecution in the U.S.);

Whose deportation has been withheld under section 243(h) of the INA as in effect prior to April 1, 1997, or whose removal has been withheld under section 241(b)(3) of the INA;

Granted conditional entry as a refugee under section 203(a)(7) of the INA as in effect prior to April 1, 1980;

Inspected and admitted as a non-immigrant to the U.S. and who has not violated the applicable terms of your status (NOTE: Generally non-immigrants, with a few exceptions, are not eligible for SSI benefits; this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas.);

With a pending application for political asylum under section 208(a) of the INA or a pending application for withholding of deportation under section 243(h) of the INA, and employment authorization; or

Belonging to any specific class of aliens permitted to remain in the U.S. under U.S. law or policy, for humanitarian, medical or other public interest policy reasons.更多精彩文章及讨论，请光临枫下论坛 rolia.net

此结论来自你的链接。 -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 (#9403723@0)
SEE G SECTION. Inspected and admitted as a non-immigrant to the U.S. and who has not violated the applicable terms of your status (NOTE: Generally non-immigrants, -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 {170} (#9403743@0)
with a few exceptions, are not eligible for SSI benefits; this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas.);

????, 人家写了NOTE: Generally non-immigrants, with a few exceptions, are not eligible for SSI benefits; this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas.); -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {52} (#9403772@0)
你不会以为"U","T" NON-IMMIRANT VISA 就是指TN VISA吧?

T Nonimmigrant Eligibility -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403797@0)
U Nonimmigrant Eligibility -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403800@0)
你猜对了，是我理解错误。我混同了T AND TN VISA. -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 (#9403841@0)

这是说SSI,不是SS.SSI是supplemental socual income。差一个字母差十万八千里，不要搞混了。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9404086@0)

为什么会有只交一份钱确要拿两份福利的想法呢？美加两国的守法公民会同意吗？ -camerina(Camerina); 2015-4-24 (#9403834@0)

我完全同意.因为: -jiaqitang(有赌未必输); 2015-4-24 {178} (#9403843@0)
1. 拿加拿大CPP+OAS

2.拿SS

3.拿SS+CPP+OAS

这三种方试,无论哪一个最好到手的钱差不多.

所以,纠结有没有绿卡,能不能在加拿SS是没意义的,有绿卡的占不到便宜,没绿卡的也吃不到亏.

这样是合理的。 -camerina(Camerina); 2015-4-24 (#9404082@0)

为什么会有只挣一份工资钱确要交两份税的想法呢？美加两国的守法公民会同意吗？！！！！！！ -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 (#9403844@0)

美加两国并不重复收税，只会根据不同的税务政策补差。 -camerina(Camerina); 2015-4-24 (#9404092@0)

如果美加政府的规定中确实指出，可以只交一份钱而拿两份福利，那就是说，美加两国的守法公民已经同意了。 -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403852@0)

不要自作聪明。有句话叫“出来混总是要还的”。 -camerina(Camerina); 2015-4-24 (#9404084@0)

如果美加两国的守法公民已经同意了，你不管是自作聪明还是自作傻瓜，都是无济于事的。 -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9404123@0)

自作傻瓜的人蛮多的。据说有数十万人不知道自己能拿SS，所以没有申请，很多都是外国人或者非法劳工。特别是 DISABILITY INSURANCE BENEFITS. -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9404136@0)

很难理解吗？因为OAS是不交钱也能拿的。交0份钱拿一份福利，交一份钱当然拿两份福利，交两份钱拿三份福利。1+1=2.2+1=3.幼儿园都会算吧 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9404097@0)

这句话再送你一次：不要自作聪明。 -camerina(Camerina); 2015-4-24 (#9404106@0)

凭本事挣钱、按规矩纳税才是正道。不义之财不可取！！ -camerina(Camerina); 2015-4-24 (#9404100@0)

大家正在讨论到底规矩是怎样的和对规矩的理解。 -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9404116@0)
义之财该取就取！！ -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9404176@0)

万分同意！ -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 (#9404204@0)

万分同意凭本事挣钱、按规矩纳税！也万分同意享受因纳税而得的福利！只尽义务，不享受权利，这就是美国强盗所为。据本人经验，自作傻瓜，而非自作聪明的人占社会多数！！！ -renrenlao(niuniu); 2015-4-24 (#9404213@0)

身边有个实例，一个人的姐姐是香港老移民，在加拿大工作10年后去了美国纽约工作到退休，她现在拿SS+CPP+OAS, -longhope(hope); 2015-4-25 (#9404741@0)
当然这个实例只能说明能拿，至于拿多少要根据住加拿大的年数和在美国交了多少SS有关。 -longhope(hope); 2015-4-25 (#9404748@0)

再给各链接，测试能不能拿的工具。官网，简单点，省得读了 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9403399@0)

Payments Outside the United States. We are sorry but, The Payments Abroad Screening Tool is designed to assist Title II Social Security beneficiaries. -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9403919@0)

title ii 就是我们讨论的东西。全名叫TITLE II—FEDERAL OLD–AGE, SURVIVORS, AND DISABILITY INSURANCE BENEFITS。 -steve888(Steve曾经曰(yuē)过); 2015-4-24 (#9404101@0)

Since you are a resident of one of the countries with which the United States has a Social Security (Totalization) Agreement, your payments will continue as long as you are a resident of an International Social Security (Totalization) Agreement Country. -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-24 (#9404112@0)

看了老印的一link是可以拿，有老印在美国才工作８年就４４个点了 -victroy(vc); 2015-4-24 (#9404216@0)
刚发现我发错了：加国2013年CPP最高只有1012/月，不是“2012/月”。 -base2(alcohol); 2015-4-25 (#9404427@0)

你发错的是：你其实可以用REPLY功能。欢迎参加讨论。 -eiorui(eu); 2015-4-25 (#9404439@0)

@Florida

1725.3 How Do You Prove That You Are A Lawful Alien? SEE INSIDE. this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas。结论：SS可以拿！

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@Florida

1725.3 How Do You Prove That You Are A Lawful Alien? SEE INSIDE. this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas。 结论：SS可以拿！

Replies, comments and Discussions:

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1725.3 How Do You Prove That You Are A Lawful Alien? SEE INSIDE. this applies to all non- immigrant classes of admissions with the exception of "T" or "U" non-immigrant visas。结论：SS可以拿！